CAI question

[Adam071406]

Looking for information on what enclosed CAI flows the most. I was looking at the Eventuri, R600, and the Blaze Performance ATOM Race V2 intakes. What intake flows the most?

 

[The Fed]

What tune do you have? If you're stock, you're just paying hundreds of dollars for noise. It doesn't matter what they flow, it's how much flow the engine needs.

 

[GTI_Owner]

The intake itself is the wrong part to focus on, the inlet pipe that attaches to the turbocharger has a much greater effect on the turbocharger's operation.

I think it is splitting hairs over some of these closed intakes, but if I were choosing I'd use the R600, Forge, or AMS. I use the Eventuri, but Racingline and Forge flow a touch better.

Blaze is an average intake with above-average marketing driving its popularity. See the first quote here by an EQT team member before EQT became the exclusive distributor of the Blaze intake in North America. It's a validation of my point about the effect of the inlet elbow versus the intake.

What tune do you have? If you're stock, you're just paying hundreds of dollars for noise. It doesn't matter what they flow, it's how much flow the engine needs.

What they flow at a fixed pressure differential, which is how flow rate is normally measured, is an indicator of how much resistance the intake causes. Reducing the resistance, by way of increased flow rate, increases the efficiency of the turbocharger and in turn that of the engine. The engine will draw in what it needs, how hard it has to work to do that is what changes with different intake flow rates.

I agree with you on the point about the stock setup not needing an intake upgrade, the airflow rate isn't high enough to generate enough pressure drop to make a significant difference, significant to me is more than 2-3 peak whp.

 

[Adam071406]

The intake itself is the wrong part to focus on, the inlet pipe that attaches to the turbocharger has a much greater effect on the turbocharger's operation.

I think it is splitting hairs over some of these closed intakes, but if I were choosing I'd use the R600, Forge, or AMS. I use the Eventuri, but Racingline and Forge flow a touch better.

Blaze is an average intake with above-average marketing driving its popularity. See the first quote here by an EQT team member before EQT became the exclusive distributor of the Blaze intake in North America. It's a validation of my point about the effect of the inlet elbow versus the intake.


What they flow at a fixed pressure differential, which is how flow rate is normally measured, is an indicator of how much resistance the intake causes. Reducing the resistance, by way of increased flow rate, increases the efficiency of the turbocharger and in turn that of the engine. The engine will draw in what it needs, how hard it has to work to do that is what changes with different intake flow rates.

I agree with you on the point about the stock setup not needing an intake upgrade, the airflow rate isn't high enough to generate enough pressure drop to make a significant difference, significant to me is more than 2-3 peak whp.

I have this inlet pipe. https://www.mst-performance.com/products/vw-mk710v2

 

[Adam071406]

The intake itself is the wrong part to focus on, the inlet pipe that attaches to the turbocharger has a much greater effect on the turbocharger's operation.

I think it is splitting hairs over some of these closed intakes, but if I were choosing I'd use the R600, Forge, or AMS. I use the Eventuri, but Racingline and Forge flow a touch better.

Blaze is an average intake with above-average marketing driving its popularity. See the first quote here by an EQT team member before EQT became the exclusive distributor of the Blaze intake in North America. It's a validation of my point about the effect of the inlet elbow versus the intake.


What they flow at a fixed pressure differential, which is how flow rate is normally measured, is an indicator of how much resistance the intake causes. Reducing the resistance, by way of increased flow rate, increases the efficiency of the turbocharger and in turn that of the engine. The engine will draw in what it needs, how hard it has to work to do that is what changes with different intake flow rates.

I agree with you on the point about the stock setup not needing an intake upgrade, the airflow rate isn't high enough to generate enough pressure drop to make a significant difference, significant to me is more than 2-3 peak whp.

R600 with the foam filter right? How long does the foam last hot humid weather? Possibly looking for the best flowing oiled filter with a closed air box.

 

[GTI_Owner]

R600 with the foam filter right? How long does the foam last hot humid weather? Possibly looking for the best flowing oiled filter with a closed air box.

With a stock turbo, the difference between the MST V1 and V2 is negligible, both work well. They're 3" inlets, so you'll need an inlet hose that is sized to fit them, along with the Racingline filter housing. The Racingline inlet hose is meant for a stock 2.75" inlet elbow, not the upsize MST uses, so you'd use the MST inlet hose also with the R600, although I can't say how well it would fit since that isn't a combination that I have tried.

I've used the R600 with the cotton filter. At least when new it flows around the same as the foam filter.

 

[kep]

If you're looking for performance, I have never seen actual data indicating that any of these help. Flow bench data does not tell the full story for intakes.

 

[GTI_Owner]

If you're looking for performance, I have never seen actual data indicating that any of these help. Flow bench data does not tell the full story for intakes.

Flow bench data with intakes is like the weight of wheels, although pressure loss, or weight, doesn't tell the whole story, some correlations tell part of the story, like this test of the APR closed intake vs modified stock.

I think comparing filtration efficiency is too costly to perform to hope to ever see a comparison of that part of the story.

A collection of intakes I've taken temperature measurements with suggests having a heat shield, or not, is one of the main factors affecting the air temperature going into the turbo.

As I said in my first response, I think it is splitting hairs with these intakes since other parts have more effect.

 

[Adam071406]

Would data logging these aftermarket intakes show if they are beneficial for efficiency?

 

[Adam071406]

Flow bench data with intakes is like the weight of wheels, although pressure loss, or weight, doesn't tell the whole story, some correlations tell part of the story, like this test of the APR closed intake vs modified stock.

I think comparing filtration efficiency is too costly to perform to hope to ever see a comparison of that part of the story.

A collection of intakes I've taken temperature measurements with suggests having a heat shield, or not, is one of the main factors affecting the air temperature going into the turbo.

As I said in my first response, I think it is splitting hairs with these intakes since other parts have more effect.

I have a MST inlet and hose already, just asking if a aftermarket air box would be beneficial towards efficiency.

 

[The Fed]

If you're in one of the hot areas in Texas, I think your money would be better spent on an intercooler. As I recall, the stock intake still won't be the restricting factor. what's the advertised numbers for your tune?

 

[GTI_Owner]

Would data logging these aftermarket intakes show if they are beneficial for efficiency?

Yes, but there are only minor differences between the intakes. The turbocharger wastegate duty cycle will give you some indication of how much work the compressor is doing to compress the air, but that's a function of pressure loss and temperature (density). You would need to control the temperature of the air as it enters the compressor, or at least record it to account for variance, if you want to evaluate pressure loss on the car.

There's no way to measure the temperature without adding a temperature sensor just before the turbo.

Since the differences are small, all of the extraneous variability (noise) is going to make it hard to detect changes caused by the air intake (signal value). Collecting several data points can help to mitigate this but you first need to estimate the size of the difference you expect there to be along with the amount of variance so that you can estimate the number of samples to take.

If you have a stock turbo I don't think this is something to be concerned with, any of the identified intakes will suit that application.

 

[Adam071406]

If you're in one of the hot areas in Texas, I think your money would be better spent on an intercooler. As I recall, the stock intake still won't be the restricting factor. what's the advertised numbers for your tune?

400 crank torque/ 400 crank HP

 

[Adam071406]

Yes, but there are only minor differences between the intakes. The turbocharger wastegate duty cycle will give you some indication of how much work the compressor is doing to compress the air, but that's a function of pressure loss and temperature (density). You would need to control the temperature of the air as it enters the compressor, or at least record it to account for variance, if you want to evaluate pressure loss on the car.

There's no way to measure the temperature without adding a temperature sensor just before the turbo.

Since the differences are small, all of the extraneous variability (noise) is going to make it hard to detect changes caused by the air intake (signal value). Collecting several data points can help to mitigate this but you first need to estimate the size of the difference you expect there to be along with the amount of variance so that you can estimate the number of samples to take.

If you have a stock turbo I don't think this is something to be concerned with, any of the identified intakes will suit that application.

Thank you.

 

[The Fed]

400 crank torque/ 400 crank HP

I'd go for the intercooler upgrade if it's hot and humid there. I believe APR still makes one that fits in the stock location. I get heat soak on the stock tune in the summer. You're doing a good amount of extra compression of the air, and I don't see how an intake will benefit more than an intercooler upgrade.